Posted by Julia from bootp245174.medill.northwestern.edu (129.105.245.174) on Wednesday, February 27, 2002 at 5:34PM :
In Reply to: Smashing Pumpkins posted by pancho from ? (64.79.4.2) on Wednesday, February 27, 2002 at 4:21PM :
On your point about annoying people:
Again, I only had a problem with you annoying people when you linked annoying people as part of your goal to serve dying children. I would not care if you annoyed people if you were just some joe shmoe looking to piss people off; i was struck by the idea that someone could annoint the process of annoying people as a process and a goal that serves the interests of dying children...
Again, that is something that you decided, and if you genuinely believe that your work of annoying people, like the work of your hands when you make sculptures, fits the interests of dying children (and i'm not being sarcastic), ok.
When i told you to go to iraq, i said that not to get rid of annoying fred, or to say good riddance to you. I said that because in my mind, this was the calculation I made: dying children need people to alleviate their dying status; they need people to accumulate foodstuffs, medicines, etc; they need people also to see them and work with them and be with them; they are not some detached entity but they have faces and bodies and personalities. And, again, in my mind annoying people now in order to prevent the deaths of children in the future does preclude the immediate assistance of the children now. That's all.
And, fred, why is it that you chose the word 'annoy' but not criticize? Do you really think you have more power as a person advancing a cause when you annoy people and not criticize arguments? When i say criticize, you can weigh evidence and see other viewpoints and respectfully advance one based not on !!!! or hysteria but on the evidence before you, admitting that the evidence itself is not perfect or absolute. IF the bulk of your work goes towards advancing the interests of dying children, and you keep getting kicked off of forums, you can blame the forum or you can see what you can do to change the delivery and not the content of what you are saying.
: It's a strange argument to say that you either stop all abuse everywhere at once...or leave off whatever group you happen to be shining a light upon and go somewhere else and pick another group.
: If I single out Tahitians, someone comes along and says, "why Tahitians?...what about Eskimos, they are hurting too" So I leave the Tahitians and rush to the Eskimos, only to have someone tell me that it's foolish to think only Eskimos are hurting...what about Fijians...so off I go to Fiji...to hear yet again that Fijians aren't the only ones afflicted, "you fool", and how about the Shoshone Indians...by now I just smash the person saying all of this.
: And when you stop to consider that the person saying this is a Christian...or worse yet, is a member of each of the groups it sends me AWAY from...you want to smash 'em again and again...except, what makes you think that only THIS person deserves to be smashed?...so you go back to where you started and smash everyone there and move right along cause you want to be fair and smash everybody.
: And in the end, instead of helping any one of a number of suffering and deserving groups...you are driven to smashing EVERYBODY just because of this little twit...whose entire point was to get you to stop annoying her....except how come you only want to stop annoying her...do you realize there are lots of people in the world you shouldn't annoy and on and on.
: note: Alli...come back, all is forgiven, You don't have to make sense, you don't have to do anything, just BE, dude, just be who you are, dude.
-- Julia
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