Posted by pancho from pool0044.cvx24-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net (188.8.131.52) on Friday, November 22, 2002 at 7:42AM :
In Reply to: Re: Not All Palestinians Are Muslim... posted by sankho from CPE-203-45-1-117.vic.bigpond.net.au (184.108.40.206) on Friday, November 22, 2002 at 1:12AM :
: You are what you call yourself. Period. The Arab-speaking 'Assyrians' identify themselves with Sunni Arab culture;
+++The English speaking Assyrians identify themselves with Americans and other Western Christians Powers.
the "Christian" Assyrians identify with a culture that goes back through 2 thousand years of Christian culture LINKED unbreakably with non-Christian Assyrian culture thru the 'pagan' Kindgoms of Urhai, Nissibn, Arbela etc.
+++They are obviously not linked "unbreakably"...they couldn't be more broken. The very fairy tale of Abgar...brought to us not by any Assyrian entity, but by a Jew one...tells of foreign gods delivering more goodies and gaining the undying gratitude of Assyrians...tell me, if that is to be the criteria by which we choose "God"...what prayers for relief has this Jesus granted to any suffering Assyrian since old Abgar got the Clap? Please...this is silly.
The 'Arab-speaking' "Assyrians" do not identify with that AT all.
+++Why the hell would they? What English speaking Christian Assyrian identifies with Muhammad? Who would ask such a thing of them?
+++You again assume that there is a gene in Assyrians who turned Christian...an Assyrio/Christian gene...when it was just a fickle disposition to go shopping for gods with goodies. Obviously Muslim Assyrians saw some benefit accruing to them from Allah...not everyone had only the Clap to worry about...other Assyrians probably wished to protect their lands from the Byzantines...or just found in conquering Islam a better means of retaining their independance and scalps than by following Jesus up onto the cross.
+++Your basic assumption is that...Assyrians all turned to Christianity and no other religion...that by turning to Christianity they ensured their Assyrian roots would be preserved...and ipsi pipsi what we have today of CHRISTIAN Assyrian culture MUST be the only authentic ASSYRIAN identity...because we TALK ABOUT IT A LOT!
... they identify with Arab moslem history ipso facto they are ARAB;
+++No sir. What you like to call Arab is Muslim influenced Assyrian/Persian...just as what you like to call Assyrian is Israeli influenced Assyrianism. Muslim history came after Christian history. Having a "link" to Urhai no more makes you Assyrian than having a link to Israel makes us Jewish. Iraqis simply absorbed and adopted the next religion to come through the land...one that didn't come from Israel through Urhai or whatever. You are hardly being scientific or logical...you have a vested interest in finding the facts you're desperately seeking. me...I am neither Christian, Muslim or Jew...I have no affinity for Israel or Arabia. I don't care if we all turn to Budhism or Confucianism...makes me no mind. I'm interested in what we DO...not what we pray to....except for the one true god we had from the beginning...before some dipsomaniac got the clap and religion at the same time. To you guys it MUST be true...your pet notions HAVE to be "proven"...and so you labor mightily to force the point.
+++I just look around me...and none of you make any sense. religions came to Iraq and influenced the people. I don't care what they call themselves...I am no more impressed that Golani is an Assyrian than I am that Ali or Jaabar ISN'T. What impresses me most is who is doing what to all that remains of the Assyrian Heritage. And I see our Christians rooting for more death and destruction...and I see our Iraqi Muslims AND Christians fighting to preserve the land under terrible conditions...while our latte guzzling Christian/Americans imagine themselves ambassadors for a new Assyria...brought to them courtesy of Murder Inc.
the moslem Assyrians associate with THAT LINK TO THE non -Christian Assyrian past and THEREFORE CALL THEMSELVES ASSYRIAN MOSLEMS....what don't you get?
++++I can understand your reverence for what people "call themselves". Especially as we all got out and now call ourselves Australians or Americans. Regardless of these labels...being Assyrian does not mean being of one or another religion...as it also has nothing to do with genes...we were all mixing it up from the dawn of civilization...it mattered not at all then just as today it matters not at all where you came from...only that you ACT the part of a loyal American or whatever. Who examines genes to determine nationality these days? Iraqis come to America and quickly stop acting like Iraqis...watch how many of us fall all over ourselves trying to prove we are true and loyal Americans.
+++I have an equally modern and pragmatic definition of what it is to be Assyrian...one that wont keep us barefoot and pregnant and fascistic...looking for "pure" and "true" Assyrians. Anyone who shows loyalty and love for BetNahrain...whatever it is CALLED and whatever the people TALK ABOUT A LOT...is a true Assyrian...one for the modern world...not the Medeival one most of us occupy...as we get trashed by those living in this century.
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