|Re: Faulty Basics|
- Wednesday, May 21 2008, 3:13:38 (CEST)|
from 220.127.116.11 - pool-71-116-96-214.snfcca.dsl-w.verizon.net Network - Windows XP - Internet Explorer
>Let’s get a little more serious for a little while...
...we've been serious all along.
>The fundamental problem which needs to be solved, first, before any constructive discussion can take place is “Truth”:
...YOU are going to settle what "truth" is.....you????? YOU????????
whenever you claim that some idea is true, what exactly do you mean by “true”?
..what do you mean by "exactly"? All you're trying to do with this pseudo-intellectual fluff is obscure a very simple incident in which you asked for a quote from the bible and I presented it...so now you've decided to "get serious" and "seek truth"...and EXACT truth...things no one has EVER ben able to agree upon enough to convince the opposition...you're just trying to obfuscate...but we see you.
And what does it mean if you say that it ISN’T true? It is impossible to “agree” with someone over the truth of a claim if you are not speaking the same “language” of truth. Therefore, it is impossible for any of us to agree on “truth” while each one of us sees things from a different perspective... Agree? People disagree because their understanding of words is different, and the most important word to understand the meaning of is “Truth”, because that exposes the person to himself...
..it is not YOUR place to tell us what Jesus really said...not your place at all. The quote taken from the gospel of St John has the words of Jesus himself, not "opinion"..and the words clearly convey the message that Christians are to eat and drink Jesus...there is nothing "relative" in these words or metaphorical or symbollical...Jesus himself, and the church, make sure of that by emphasing that this bread and wine is the ACTUAL flesh and blood of Jesus...and if they could have gotten their hands on you 300 years ago they would have killed you for saying what you now say..it's YOUR religion...why take it out on us?
>So, it doesn’t matter how many millions of people believe something to be “true”, the FACT is, they could well be wrong.
...we got over that already...you objected to millions of Christians believing and enforcing this disgusting practise as sufficient to make the case...you demanded that we bring ACTUAL quotes from the bible...and we DID. So this is not the issue any longer..it isn't about millions of people believing somehting that may or may not be wrong...it's about ONE PERSON...your "God"...who ACTUALLY said this and made sure to make it clear that he MEANT it...meant that he was talking about flesh and blood...not bread and wine.
And it doesn’t matter how many millions of people believe something to be “false”, they could well be wrong, as well... So before we waste more time on what the “truth” of a certain passage is or isn’t, lets understand what “truth” MEANS first. Fair? Failing that, all we will be doing is playing the “I am holier than thou” game.
..it is not a "certain passage"..and it is not up to you, with your high school education and Mary whom you diddle in the backseat urging you on to tell US what GOD REALLY MEANT! Are you serious? Jesus said it...and the words of Jesus guide Christianity NOT yours
>So before you claim something is “true”, define “truth”, first. Spill your understanding about what truth means to you.
..I did that when I said the "truth" is that Christianity teaches cannibalism etc. You said that was merely "your view"...and yet now, when I bring you the words of Jesus himself, YOU say we need to listen to YOUR opinion...skip anyone's opinion, including yours, except the words of Jesus...and Jesus proposed cannibalism...I realize you don't like admitting it...but that doesn't change the fact that he SAID it and that the church ENFORCED it for centuries...and still does...though not by burning at the stake.
.. If you decide to use a dictionary, make sure you define and explain EVERY word that is used to define the original word (in this case “truth). What I mean by that is this: When the dictionary defines Truth as “Reality, Actuality”, you have to define and explain fully what “Reality” AND “Actuality” mean.
...I never needed the dictionary or used it for "truth"...I used it for the definition of "transubstantiation" and YOU said fuck the dictionary..and NOW you come back and ask for DICTIONARIES? Are you ONLY consistent in being slimey?
>If you decide to get serious, start with the BASICS first, and the basics aren’t in any “holly” book; they are in your own mind... And those basics decide how you interpret everything around you, be it a major thing like “Religion” or simple thing like “Friendship”.
...that wasn't what you said when I told you that IN MY MIND Christianity taught canniblaims..when I said that, YOU said this was ONLY what was in MY MIND! And when I brought the dictionary to bear as witness YOU said the dictionary was meaningless...just what "someone says"...until YOU felt the need for a dictionary...then you said you wanted a DIRECT quote from the Bible...from Jesus himself...like a decent person trying to please, I went out and got you THAT as well...and NOW you come telling me that we shouldn't believe the bible EITHER!!!
It seems you have a god-complex. What we're supposed to do..what you consider right to do...is take our definitions from YOU! When you tell us a dictionary is crap, we are to listen...when you tell us it's time to use a dictionary, we must listen...when you tell us that only a quote from the bible is valid...we're supposed to listen...and when you decide that a quote from the bible is meaningless, we're again supposed to believe YOU.
Who made a god out of you?
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