The Inside Assyria Discussion Forum #5

=> Tiglath: On Comparing Christians and Oranges

Tiglath: On Comparing Christians and Oranges
Posted by pancho (Moderator) - Monday, September 13 2010, 16:07:15 (UTC)
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...seems to me weīre confounding issues...mixing things that donīt belong together.

You are saying it isnīt nice to kill people who want to be free, even if they are your citizens, have been for centuries, and choose the worst time, for the government, to do it AND take money and gunes from those attacking the nation.

And I agree with you. It is NOT nice to kill people...any people under whatever pretext whatever...but no government can last long if itīs nice to those attacking it and especially to those among its own ciitzens who join in the attack, from within.

Are you also saying that a government must not defend itself against treason and that, if it was so unwise as to leave distinct "groups" among its majority population and to never have forced them to adopt one identity before, that this government must not harm those who rebel against its lawful authority, if they are from some group?

Is that what youīre faulting the Turks for? For not doing what no other government on earth would have done?

This is only one difficulty in diluting the meaning of genocide...anyone killing any members of any group should be called something else...in an era when governments HAVE tried to wipe out groups, governments and not just members or mobs, we need a definite and distinct word to denote such actions...which are altogether different from an individual or mob attacking groups...surely there is a difference between one, or ten, pastor nut jobs burning a Quran and the United States government doing it...no?

Further, though Germany was also in a state of war, as were the Turks, Germany brought on the war..it attacked and then declared war...the Turks did not. The Turks were attacked and so all the more critical was it for them to weed out those who sided with the attackers, by whatever means governments use in these situations. And there was never any credible evidence that the Jews posed any military threat to Germany, at all, or were leagued with the Allies....whereas there is plenty of evidence that the Armenians and assyrians engaged in guerilla attacks against their lawful government.

If we grant the rights of citizens to rebel, for freedom etc, then we must also grant governments the right to defend themselves from rebellion....welcome to the world.

This is nothing more than a Christian Crusade, perhaps fuelled by a little embarrassment, to smear the Turks with their own crimes of Genocide. The evidence for it almost entirely comes from hearsay or "reports" from missionaries and Allies diplomats, none of whom can be trusted to tell the unvarnished truth. No one denies that Christians were killed...as no one should deny that Christians, in league with foreigners, attacked and killed that many more innocent Muslim citizens...and no one denies that a nation has the right and obligation to defend itself in war and treason from within...then what are we arguing about?

You insist that the Turks MUST have committed genocide because "Look...there are all these murdered Christians". But dead and murdered Christians are not evidence of genocide....genocide needs more than that...at the least it needs a clear policy-statement from a government that it is targetting a group SIMPLY for being "a group"...and this was not the case in Turkey...once again Christians are crying that Muslims kill them just because they donīt like them, or want to cleanse them, or force them to alter their identity (though churches remained open and Christianity exists in Turkey to this day...so what exactly were the Turks trying to "cleanse"?)...it is NEVER because of what Christians DO, but just for they are.

The Turks turned on their Christian citizens because of what those Christian citizens DID...not because of what they WERE...the Germans turned on their Jews because of what those Jews WERE, not for anything they DID...anything illegal anyway. The Germans acted out of pure hatred for a religious group, while the Turks had PROTECTED and DEFENDED their Christians even while conquering Christian nations...as which power has NOT conquered others? Never in their history had Turks behaved in this manner so we must assume something provoked them..and even if you claim it was a desire to forge one nation by the Turks, still, what prompted thenm to begin it when they did...anything?



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