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Re: Armenia
Posted by Dean (Guest) - Tuesday, September 21 2004, 18:44:35 (CEST)
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Parhad,

Again, I repeat, the burden of proof is on you and that’s where it will remain... period.

You have accused Christianity in the East of crimes against humanity, yet you can’t substantiate your charge for one minute.

Your case would be thrown out on its face.

Have you ever met an Armenian?

Have you asked one about their personal or national history?

Where I live, there are literally hundreds of thousands of Armenians. Throughout my life here I must have personally asked hundreds of them about their history and culture. I have Armenian family members as well, and recently I have been surveying them for their opinions and not one of them have even come close to your position.

When I describe your views, they laugh and have pity on such ignorance.

Are you saying that you know more about their history than they themselves do?

Are you suggesting they are all ignorant or brain-washed and need you to rewrite their national history books?

And you call us arrogant!

I challenge you to find even one Armenian to agree with you!

-Dean



Parhad wrote:
>Dean wrote:
>>Parhad?
>>
>>You expect us to believe your ridiculous statement ... "hadn’t seen this" ? Of course you did, you replied several times within that thread?
>
>...if I were lying...like you...I would have kept it up...ask me how much it matters what you think...
>>
>>Anyways,
>>
>>It's easy for you to dismiss my historical points without presenting the supposed error.
>
>...they weren`t historical..they were hysterical..I told you already..you always do this like you were in Sunday School and no one notices because we`re all children...you guess. That Constantine SAID he saw Jesus in the sky, is indeed a historical FACT...that does not mean he saw Jesus as a FACT. That`s the same thing you`ve done..you`ve presented the FACT that your church says Greg converted Armeninas....that your church says so is the FACT...that he actually DID so...is NOT! What could be easier...hance most difficult for you...since it`s the simple truth with no bells and whizbangs to it? You presented YOUR fairy tales as facts because you found a reference to them "in history"...that doesn`t mean a thing.
>>
>>Where in each point did I misstate a historic fact?
>
>..I told you...what your church says Greg did doesnt mean he did..or that he ever existed...are we now to play this game for a week...
>>
>>The bottom line is, just like in a court of law, people and organization are INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY.
>
>...And you arent allowed to enter hearsay evidence in a court..you have no witnesses that Greg ever existed...you would need more than church fairy tales...you cant bring "miracles" into court...silly.
>>
>>You have leveled an accusation, a charge of forced conversion, if you will, upon Christianity in the East, people of several nations, and regions. Yet you have no evidence.
>
>...I have factual accounts of your behaviors and lies...all of you. You also have no evidence..I told you, church "history" is unacceptable. Neither you nor I have the actual evidence of how it was accomplished...stripped of all padding your argument comes down to this: The church says the church used no force. That they have said this IN HISTORY and throughout the ages for 10,000 years does NOT make the event factual..it makes their CLAIM factual...this is so tedious.
>
>
> Your accusation wouldn’t make it past any grand jury.
>
>...if there is sufficient cause to look into it further, it would...your church fantasies certainly wouldnt get in.
>
> The accused would have to be released on there own recognizance since you have not made a sufficient case against them. Not a shred of evidence, no historical witnesses, no affidavits in the form of documents, not even circumstantial evidence. The burden of proof remains on you, the self-proclaimed prosecutor.
>
>...and you don÷t have any either..your church documents are NOT factual. All history says is that YOU have said this for years..so what. On that basis the earth could still be flat till proven otherwise...why should people have to accept your account of events just because no one was back then to take pictures...if YOU make the ridiculous claim that people converted willingly..YOU have to provide the evidence they did so and Greg is NOT evidence..he is YOUR claim. Those of us who look at the record of ALL of Christianity see what violence and disruption you people have caused EVERYWHERE you could get away with it...therefore we have plenty of historical record for the claim that you are violent people...we dont have any direct evidence for what happened in Armenia and neither do you...so shut up about the Law.
>>
>>I have presented evidence as a defense attorney, even though my client is presumed innocent and in reality we have the right to remain silent and await the prosecution's evidence. Yet there is none. YOU HAVE OFFERED NOTHING
>
>..I told you...your church-s claim for miracles is not acceptable..I told you that from the start. The rest of the "facts" you mentioned have nothing to do with the accusation that your church could NOT have impressed anybody to join it...not an entire culture..and you have no proof that they did...there is NO evidence anywhere on earth of a culture or civilization doing so..not anywhere...just because there is no historical evidence, not church stories, but an unbiased historical record for what happened in Armenia does not justify your making a completely nonsenscial assumtion that in THIS case your church behaved in ways it NEVER did when anyone was looking.
>>
>>My evidence is the simple historic facts surrounding the events up to Armenia's acceptance of Christianity.
>
>..and your facts stop there...and you shift to church propaganda..which is NOT factual, but fanciful. St Patrick didnt convert the Irish away from their rich Celtic ways by driving out snakes..fer heavins sake...HONESTLY..you people are too much.
>
>
> It is not merely church history. The facts I presented are available in any encyclopedia or world history book.
>
>
>..here we go again...no one is disputing the dates for Constantine and the rest of it..I AM disputing your church claims of persecution..the fantasy that there were MILLIONS of happy Christians who got persecuted to death or converted away..that is pure bullshit..another lie you pawn off by saying..can you PROOVE there werent MILLIONS...HA. History does indeed record what your church SAYS...as they tell us the words of many an insane person...but it does not tell us that what your church says HAPPENED.
>
>
> I challenge you again to find one erro in the facts. There was, and I repeat was NO ARMY, NOR A MILITANT CHURCH capable of forcing Armenians to convert at the time they did. It wasn’t until many years later that Constantine had the capability to force anyone to become Christian. And even then, there is no historical account that Rome conducted a crusade against Armenia.
>
>...we dropped Rome long ago...catch up. There is no historical record of what happened...not in Armenia..and you haven÷t shown any evidence to back up your claim..there is a void which you÷ve merely stuffed church documents and legends into...but it wont do. The real facts you presented are undisputable...why would anyone argue...but the conclusion you draw..that what the church says happened REALLY happened is ridiculous..and we KNOW what liars you people are to THIS DAY...run along and play.
>>
>>-Dean



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