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=> Re: Stop Pretending the US is an Uninvolved,...

Re: Stop Pretending the US is an Uninvolved,...
Posted by Marcello (Guest) - Sunday, November 18 2012, 20:38:20 (UTC)
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I'm not in disagreement with you about who's calling the shots. But reading comments by Jewish American activists in solidarity with the Palestinian people regarding the Israeli mindset gives me no hope about them wanting a Two-state settlement. Here are two comments by American Jews:


Danna:

"I have been saying for quite a while that the well-meaning visitors to israel – especially those who don’t speak hebrew – bury their heads in the sand about what israelis really want and how they speak.

If you Phil could only read one hundredth of what israelis are putting on their facebooks – most of it in Hebrew, you wouldn’t be shocked. You would go into full PTSD lock-down mode. That’s why I wouldn’t suggest having anyone translate a sample for you.

“Kill the all”, “Nuke them” “Get rid of them” is the most common sentiment you hear in israel and it looks like you got a very small dose of it in your interviews. Max Blumental had it right in “Feeling the Hate” because hate is the most common sentiment you find among israelis – may be not the fine, sensitive, humanistic ones who host you there – but hate suffuses the common everyday speech – and not just towards Palestinians or Arabs. That sense of hatred and deep abiding antipathy towards fellow humans and the hatred bubbling just barely concealed – clearly with effort – is why I can’t talk to my relatives in israel any longer. Even the smallest of small talks brings up that unpleasant core – and when it’s not hate, it’s complete indifference to the suffering of ANYONE not Israeli. Including jewish Americans – most certainly those they call ‘bleeding hearts’ like yourself. I can’t even talk to them about cats for fear someone might – in an unguarded moment – lapse, call them “vermin” and say something about “getting rid of them all” (the most common sentiment expressed about just about anything they don’t like that disturbs THEIR “peace and quiet”).

I know we are not allowed to bring up the 30′s in a certain country in Europe and/or the notion of collective guilt. But I think you may be starting to get a little of the sense of dread that was pervasive among all kinds of people in the streets and shops and offices of that ‘certain country’. It’s the sense – actually a conviction – that something truly horrible is coming and that no one can stop it. Of course, later on, after history took it’s ghastly toll, we see lots of things common, every day and not so movers and shakers COULD have done. But it’s the dread- it has a strange preventative power.

So I’ll keep advocating we should start taking blinders off collective eyes and stop projecting our good intentions on others who don’t share them. And here is the truth Israelis – en mass- would indeed raise the whole of Gaza down – men, women, children and animals – if only the world would let them. That’s their deepest fantasy – that one day it could be done. What is ‘en mass’ is the only element about which there’s room for any argument."


Anonymouscomments:

"there is one thing that always struck me so deeply, having lived briefly in hippie south tel aviv (florentin), and in a palestinian city next to bethlehem (beit sahour)…

israelis were majority racist, and often let loose their genocidal desires. even with no infringement on their rights, and almost no violence, they were largely sickly racist, in some cultural darwinism BS mode. the few who took comething close to my view, were utterly silent. someone could say the most insane thing, and to give any resistance made you liable for verbal or possibly physical attack. to voice my view was what would cause “outrage”, and i always soft-pedaled my views for the israelis.

among all the palestinians i met, which were not entirely representative i’ll admit, they were friends with israeli activists and jews, desired one or 2 states, and did not talk in such ways….. but it is PALESTINIANS who have suffered the lion’s share of injustice, and live under repeated and constant violence and dehumanization.

i actually think that judaism does feed to some degree into this mentality we see in israelis, even though most are not religious in the least; as does the drilling in of the holocaust for psychological and political reasons. but even history and religion aside…. the root is the media and education system in israel, and the power players and political elites in israel….

the reality is that we have a very sick and racist israeli population, on the whole. almost entirely insensitive to palestinian suffering, and the attacks on their rights and their expulsion(s), while israelis live with the “benefits” of such (i see no benefit from it however).

the other very odd thing is the clear “displacement” of the respective mentalities. yes, *some* palestinians want all the jews out or some such nonsense; that is actually quite predictable given what zionism has done to them, and given their hopelessness and impotence (who would not wish away their very harsh oppressor for so many decades?). but at the core, israelis on a majority level desire or support the following, directly or indirectly-
1) the expulsion of arabs (almost all support the 1948 expulsion, many wish it was 100%, and about a majority support further actions of this type)
2) the “destruction” of palestine, which of course was never allowed to exist
->likud position deleted from the knesset website months ago, but found here-
link to jewishvirtuallibrary.org
3) the use of lies and propaganda to relentlessly advocate for their policies
4) attacks on civilians and civilian infrastructure to achieve political or military aims
5) the use of lobbying abroad, even with very questionable and even illegal means, even in a conspiratorial way, to ensure support for said repression of and effective destruction of palestine

in reality, many israelis are in denial about their very clear support for the above…. but they turn all these very real political desires and political actions on their head- and they relentlessly accuse “arabs” and “muslims” of these criminal postures.

the tragedy is that the trends and actions they accuse arabs of, they possess at more prevalent levels. further, israel has the ability, and HAS, and DOES, partake in these very crimes.

israel is like the pinnacle of hypocrisy. ever. almost everything i hear from a typical israeli supporter about the “other”, applies more tangible to themselves. i really feel like i am living in 1984 in israel, and it has seeped into the USA since 9/11/01."


... perhaps my emotional reaction to this has to do with how similar it is in tone and content to the bile I've heard from my own Assyrian family regarding Muslims in general, "Exterminate the brutes!", as in Conrad's Heart of Darkness.



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