Re: Lules

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Posted by Jeff from LTU-207-73-69-80.LTU.EDU ( on Friday, May 24, 2002 at 10:11AM :

In Reply to: Re: Lules posted by Julia from ( on Friday, May 24, 2002 at 0:31AM :

: >>>Yes, I agree ignorance is sin, especially when one is ignorant given the ready availability of information. I believe that when African presidents say that HIV/AIDS doesn't exist, his ignorance is sinful. I believe when people pretend a problem does not exist and that occurs at the expense of some person's life or well-being, that is sin.

++++ You could replace the word "sin" with "wrong" above and the same would be true. Why even use the word sin?

: >>>Please try not to oversimplify Jeff. You are making the assumption that when one says it is human nature to sin, that there is no solution. That is completely not true. I believe that God in the manifestation of Jesus Christ gave us the teachings by which our sinful nature can be transformed. Jesus' words are alive and powerful and true; they are the ideals by which all of humanity should live. Love one another as God in heaven love you. Treat others as you want to be treated. These ideals are extremely hard to achieve, but they are the ideals by which every human being should live by.

+++++ Ah, the Golden Rule. I love that rule.

: >>>>You know Jeff, i thought a lot of what is written in this forum and AINA is to debunk the hypocritical views Assyrians have towards Muslims. Yet here you are saying that CHristians just seem to kill. If you believe Christians seem to kill, then why are you my friend? Oversimplification traps Assyrian minds when they think all muslims are demons, and you are caught in the same snare of oversimplification.

+++++ I didn't mean it like THAT. Gosh. My mind is a simple one -- I can't help but to oversimplify sometimes.

: Many christians acknowlege the sins they've committed, and they turn to god for guidance and forgiveness, and in kind turn to others for forgiveness and peace. Maybe that's not the kind of Christianity you've seen, but that is true Christianity. Similarly, many people haven't seen true islam; they've seen caricatures of it with suicide bombers and OBL. Christianity is a religion of peace, love and tolerance; more importantly, it is about trying to live on this earth without being enslaved to our sinful nature. And being removed from that sinful nature is through the mercy of God.

: >>>>Ok Jeff, fred has the same argument. WHoever tries seeking vengeance on Jews for "what they did to Jesus" forgets two things. 1) Jesus is God, so he wasn't unknowingly subjected to the death by jews. He knew it was going to happen, it was SUPPOSED to happen. It was part of the plan of salvation of humanity. 2) Most importantly, if Jesus wasn't killed there would be no salvation or redemption. Jesus HAD to die. What is important is not who killed jesus, but the fact that jesus died and rose again. Those who believe that jesus' killers' descendants should be held accountable for "what the jews did" are errant and ignorant of the fact that the Messiah was suposed to die, it was part of God's plan of salvation.

+++++ It is the same argument, but it is the truth, and I'm glad you agree.

: Additionally, they fail to read parts of the new testament that clearly show integration of Jewish Christians (not just Greeks who became christians), and that they were not persecuted for being the "killers of christ." In fact, most early christians were jews to begin with.

: I hope Jeff that when you are stalwart in trying to show other Assyrians their fallacies in harboring prejudicial feelings against Musims, you will try to not do the same about Christians.

+++++ I do not hold prejudicial feelings towards Christians. What you interpreted from my post was in the contect of the word "sin". Most of my family and friends are Christians... how could that be if I hated them all?

+++++ The idea that I, and I believe Stella, have here is that the ideals of Christianity, or any religion are fine and great, but when they are twisted, corrupted, and misinterpreted by man... we all lose. Correct me if I'm wrong here.

-- Jeff
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